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lordnikon
rank 86
Posted:
Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:18 pm
quote : #1
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Posts: 5895
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How many of you are still actively buying physical Dreamcast games? I am sure many of you bought your games years ago and haven't been in the market lately.

TheMytho and I (despite having extensive collections) are still buying games, and we have been struggling with the current state of affairs.

The prices online are obnoxious. A variety of factors are all playing off of each other to drive up the prices of retro games:

  • Price trending sites
  • ebay pricing algorithms
  • the over abundance of large bulk ebay shops vs individual sellers
  • many people who were in their teens from 2002-2006 now have jobs, they are now spending money
  • users on collector forums are buying games at high prices to impress fellow forumites


Some examples for complete used copies of DC games:

Giga Wing (US) - $109.95 (https://www.pricecharting.com/game/sega-dreamcast/giga-wing)
Giga Wing 2 (US) - $159.95 (https://www.pricecharting.com/game/sega-dreamcast/giga-wing-2)
Cannon Spike (US) - $147.50 (https://www.pricecharting.com/game/sega-dreamcast/cannon-spike)


I bought Cannon Spike for $30.95 in 2007.

If we are trying to run a Dreamcast forum to talk about "playing" Dreamcast games, then this is a problem. I do not expect anyone including myself to cough up this kind of money for these games.

For example: Can I create a thread about Super Street Fighter IIX? I could, but not many members would reply. Why? Because people are willing to bid up to and spend $179.50 on SSF2X just 10 days ago: http://www.ebay.com/itm/222146684019. Thus making it near impossible for an OC community member to buy the game and talk about it here.

I just happend to have bought SSF2X complete on Digital Press forums for FIFTEEN dollars in December of 2006.

I want members to have access to games for the systems that OC covers. The colluding of the marketplace for used games and voracious purchasing habbits of obsessive collectors is disrupting our ability to accomplish this goal.

Some topics to discuss include: Piracy. Emulation. Preservation.
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mcmonkey
rank 44
Posted:
Thu Jun 30, 2016 3:33 pm
quote : #2
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Posts: 1314
Type: PAL
Yooo-ho-ho and a bo'ul o' rum!!

The last dreamcast game I bought was Pier Solar. I know it's an indie release, but I couldn't say no to the really nice packaging...

I don't tend to look online for DC games, I usually just look about in the odd game shop that still sells them. You can still get them in shops for fairly reasonable prices over here. It's also much more fun than browsing ebay!

I don't tend to pirate stuff these days, however I do have an SD card reader for my DC, which I've been meaning to put to use for quite some time.

I haven't tried emulating DC games, but I've been meaning to give some NAOMI/Model 2 games a go! Daytona 2 especially!
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Tact
rank 5
Posted:
Fri Jul 01, 2016 11:23 am
quote : #3
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Posts: 35
I agree. Dreamcast has turned a corner into retro popularity. Sales of Dreamcasts have nearly doubled in the last year or two and things that were once common are becoming harder to find. I remember back in the day game stores had so many VMUs around they wouldn't accept them as trade in, now I can't hardly find any around. Other accessories like keyboard mice and even microphones lately are becoming harder to get these days. And a lot of games that are now "collectable" prices are just ridiculous.

My suggestion is to get what you want now before its too late! XD

ps: Also thoughts about "piracy" or "preservation", I don't ever agree with piracy but at a certain point of age I mean wheres the money really going. At the time when dreamcast was current the money you spend when you buy a game went to sega and the developers, but now it really doesn't matter so much sega shouldn't have discontinued then =P. And seeing as a lot of games are becoming harder to find and dreamcasts failing to read discs a lot of people replacing drives and relying on these backups I do agree with backups , I own most of the original games that I put on my gdemu, and all the others that I really didn't care to own I download just for the sake of backup and preserving the games that become harder to get after a long time. So that more people can play the games!! "Piracy" isn't an issue anymore.
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Kbuzz
rank 23
Posted:
Sat Jul 02, 2016 11:05 am
quote : #4
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Posts: 473
Type: NTSC-U/C
I was probably the most anti-piracy voice on this board for years. But it's not 2004 and Triangle Service aren't sending out SOS letters. The world is changing, and what was once cutting edge or indie is now obscure and niche.

Dreamcast emulation on a livingroom pc has been key to keeping these games easily playable as I don't always have time or patience for discs, wired controllers, or weak optical lasers. God, it's almost like having my home renovated to accommodate an ageing gamer who doesn't want to move into a creepy nursing home (xbox live).

I still have many games that have risen in value, but I never got into Dreamcast games to cash in on the next generation of fans who missed the boat, and would never think to chastise anyone for making, sharing, or enjoying digital backups to play on whatever hardware works for them.


Daytona 2 is also very well emulated, and a dream to play Very Happy
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lordnikon
rank 86
Posted:
Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:55 am
quote : #5
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Posts: 5895
Type: NTSC-U/C
Thanks everyone for your feedback, and I welcome more if anyone has anything further to add on this topic.

I know over the years the Dreamcast community as a whole has been very much against openly discussing piracy. The community has tried to validate its foray into homebrew and emulation by distancing itself from the topic.

Times change, and I think there is a lot to be gained by providing opportunities for players to experience games that they might never be able to play otherwise.
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mcmonkey
rank 44
Posted:
Sun Jul 10, 2016 2:47 pm
quote : #6
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Posts: 1314
Type: PAL
Just to add a bit more to this topic: some dreamcast games have been out of print for about 15 years by now (if not longer). The only people making money on these games are making it due to their scarcity. The rights holders have abandoned these games in some respects by now.

Some of the most iconic titles on the system, like Shenmue or Seaman haven't had releases outside of their dreamcast releases (that I'm aware of, at least).

If people are to able to enjoy these games in an affordable fashion - the community will have to embrace piracy.
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lordnikon
rank 86
Posted:
Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:23 am
quote : #7
profile : pm
Posts: 5895
Type: NTSC-U/C
One thing I have struggled with over the years is how my money can positively impact the creative individuals that made the game, when managed by a publisher/parent company. I concluded the only way to do so would be to buy the game within the first month of its release. The success of a game is measured in the first month or two. Sales after that are predicted by bidness dudes with spreadsheets, similar to projected DVD sales for a big budget movie.

We value the artistic and intellectual experiences that developers try to bake into video games amidst a capitalist driven venture. However, the window to reward/support such efforts has traditionally been extremly narrow. Crowd Sourcing and Indie efforts seem to make this a little easier, but when a huge mega-corporation is involved... where is our money really going?

I think Trizeal is the one scenario where, yes, my dollars helped a developer stay afloat when shmups were getting eaten alive by an industry that relegated them to retro nostalgia. Recently Triangle Service released Trizeal Remix on steam. Had we not supported the developer on the Dreamcast, and just left him with half the sales, I don't think he would have been able to release his game on so many platforms (multiple NAOMI releases, PS2, 360, and now PC).

It is interesting how the nature of monitary exchange has changed for us over the years. In the past, if you want to play a game, you must hand over the dollars to gain access. The Dreamcast community has evolved its perception of currency towards "supporting" either the developers or the hobby they are interested in. We buy a game, but expect more. We want to see what happens to the developer, the people, the art, the experience after we click BUY/DONATE. We want things to sustatin, to improve.

Even with a game like Shenmue III on the way, if Sega releases Shenmue 1 & 2 in emulated format for sale, does buying these re-releases support anyone? I can only assume the money goes into the coffers of a now faceless publishing company. It helps their stock, and helps CEO's at the company buy their wives BMW's. There is little to indicate otherwise.

Also, if I pirate a used game that Sega is not selling on any digital distribution format... what are the repurcussions of this? If I pirate Record of Lodoss War or L.O.L. (Lack of Love), another gamer or an auction seller would certainly miss out on on the cash, but Sega or other copyright holders have no plans to re-market these games. Lack of Love is a game that has very high cultural and intellectual value. Should this game vanish into the darkness of time just to adhere to some DMCA copyright bullshit?

I guess our options would include:

  • We could never pirate L.O.L. and be complacent conforming citizens of government/corporate systems, making lawyers and corporations very happy.

  • We could pay a seller on an auction service inflated prices for the game, and many others like it, making it harder for us to sustain a living.

  • We could not do anything, for fear that we may be shamed by forumites across communities who look down on the practice of bending the rules in favor of cultural propogation.

  • or... we could bundle up the game with an emulator and a tutorial to help 1,000+ people experience Lack of Love, so they can reap the intellectual benefits of what the game is trying to say.
  _________________
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AphidBanner
rank 1
Posted:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:10 pm
quote : #8
profile : pm
Posts: 3
Type: Pal
I was pretty lucky with a large quantity of my collection. When the Dreamcast was discontinued here in the UK Big Ben interactive aquired a huge amount of games and were selling them for £5 each!! I managed to get both Shenmue games, Moho and various other titles. I probably bought about 30-40 games from them!! those were the days.........
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